Fighting over dragon is one of the most important parts of TT because it gives 275 gold to every member of your team. That's more than a kill each. Even if your team gets aced in the process, taking that dragon will still put you ahead. I sometimes see enemy players sacrifice two of their players just so the last one can take the dragon. The current TT metagame heavily favors tanky DPS/junglers because wriggles is such an effective build path and lets them solo dragon. Lee sin can solo dragon in easily under 10 seconds, and it's ridiculously hard for the other team to stop him. I don't think dragon should give such a huge reward to the team that gets it, considering how ridiculously easy it is to get dragon.

the thing is, although it's commonly warded area, and it can be taken down fast with wriggles, you could imply the same strategy on your team, and more accurately gauge when dragon will respawn. also, teleport is not commonly used in TT, so unless you have a TF, dragon often goes uncontested for this reason.

Timing dragon respawns really helps to secure this and will often lead to the huge team fights which make TT games so game changing.

^ agree

you really ought to time dragon. You should be there before it spawns not after. This is a shortcoming on your part and a huge part of the TT metagame.

Everytime it dies, mark the time and be there 4:30 later for the teamfight that will occur. (5min respawn)

However, lategame dragon does go down a bit too fast for its value and should probably have higher scaling HP.

I dissagree, I like how it is a defining factor for the game. I also like how I don't have to wait till 30 minutes into the game like baron to get it. In 5v5, baron gets taken down way to fast late game, and the fact that TT is a much shorter game makes its late game come early. I think it is fine as is.

3 problems with Dragon:

1. It spawns too early.

2. It's too easy to kill, especially too easy to solo - definitely needs a debuff on the enemy it attacks, like Summoner's Rift dragon.

3. Its spawn location is way too defensible. It's easy for the other two to camp outside of dragon's spot and defend one person soloing it. You basically have to suicide to contest the dragon.

I think the whole top jungle on TT could use reworking so that Dragon is at the very top of the map and is much less easy to secure and defend. The team that gets to Dragon first typically gets the Dragon, or gets a couple kills when the enemy suicides to steal it.

edit: Let me expand on this some more. The reason spawning too early is a problem is because it heavily favors team comps who are capable of winning an early dragon fight. Remember when there was level 1 dragon on Summoner's Rift, and basically there were only 10-15 viable champions in the entire game because they were the ones who were good in level 1 team fights? And TT dragon gives you a much bigger boost.

I find it absurd than anyone could argue TT dragon isn't too easy to kill/solo, considering it's weaker than the SR dragon which isn't even the main NPC objective, and gives a reward comparable to baron - in fact, at level 18 it's probably better than baron because 18% bonus damage is HUGE for such a long buff.

And for the position, I find too many long TT games devolve into both teams camping around top jungle, because if you leave the enemy team will sit themselves in the brush, kill your wards, and you'll be at a big disadvantage for the dragon fight because your lack of vision gives them a free initiate when you go to stop it. Again, another SR parallel for something that was fixed on Summoner's Rift long ago: the brush outside of Baron. It made whichever team got to Baron first win the fight and often the game.

You cant make the debate thats its highly prized and it needs to be nerfed, when u and ur team can wriggles/lee or whatever point your trying to make..dragon timing is key and having a consistent rotate on ur wards in certain areas of the map, knowing whether or not u can fight over it is key. ...1700 s1 and current...

i agree, dragon is everything in x3, its unfair

How is it unfair? Both teams have the ability to get it last I checked. Dragon just makes the game more exciting as it forces early confrontations instead of 30 minutes of farming.

Maybe increase it's HP scaling, but don't nerf it's rewards. With one or two wriggles/madreds, the thing drops in seconds past like 25 minutes.