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Why does Varus have a team wide CC ultimate

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Delimon ?? Senior Member
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05-07-2012

It's a slow spread so i can be avoided and even then it's a snare, they can still attack you just like leblanc's snare. His abilities do seem to rip off of other champs though -.-

 
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Xypherous Xypherous's Avatar ?? Technical Designer
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8 of 14 Riot Posts
05-07-2012

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I'm really concerned that you guys are making the "Sona mistake" here.

That is, remember when Sona got an AOE CC that synergized extremely well with AOE lockdown teams, a tool that wouldn't normally be given to the support class?

Now you're giving the same thing to a ranged carry. Not just AOE damage like MF/Sivir/Graves/Corki/Ezreal who all have some kind of pretty hefty AOE nuke for midgame. AOE CC that's not a slow. Ashe's hard CC is largely single target unless people are stacked right on top of each other and her damage is appreciably lower than other carries.

Now you've given a carry an AOE lockdown CC and %health spell and nobody at Riot thought this was a bad idea. I really hope I'm wrong on this one.
I agree that potentially there may be an issue here - but we've had a long standing tradition of utility carries like Ashe and Caitlyn having hard CC that hasn't proven otherwise to be problematic.

Caitlyn's CC is the definition of chain hard CC.

While the spreading and the AoE nature of it may be problematic - I think Varus has sufficient counterplay built-in such that it won't be a problem and we can explore the utility carry space some more with him.

Additionally, Varus' can't quite lockdown with his chain CC due to the spreading nature and reduced effect - it tends to not be able to lock down an entire team just due to its spread profile.

That said - I agree, potentially scary but I think potentially scary things are fun to have in the game if they can be balanced and not frustrated.

 
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Felaedor ?? Senior Member
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05-07-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Eph289 View Post
That is, remember when Sona got an AOE CC that synergized extremely well with AOE lockdown teams, a tool that wouldn't normally be given to the support class?

Now you're giving the same thing to a ranged carry. Not just AOE damage like MF/Sivir/Graves/Corki/Ezreal who all have some kind of pretty hefty AOE nuke for midgame. AOE CC that's not a slow. Ashe's hard CC is largely single target unless people are stacked right on top of each other and her damage is appreciably lower than other carries.

Now you've given a carry an AOE lockdown CC and %health spell and nobody at Riot thought this was a bad idea. I really hope I'm wrong on this one.
Go actually watch the spotlight.

The only way this comes ANYWHERE NEAR Sona ult quality is if the entire team is standing on top of eachother.

I'm pretty sure Varus' ult is the slowest moving effect in the entire game, with a VERY small leash range, and very small effective cast range in the first place because of the slow speed.

I wouldn't be surprised if you could outrun it without boots.

 
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Thryale ?? Senior Member
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05-07-2012

Okay, I just played a bot match with a lux, and purposefully got snared. Sorry bout that, it seems to be working properly. If the bug ever did exist it has apparently been fixed. Again, sorry bout that.

 
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Xypherous Xypherous's Avatar ?? Technical Designer
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9 of 14 Riot Posts
05-07-2012

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Okay, I just played a bot match with a lux, and purposefully got snared. Sorry bout that, it seems to be working properly. If the bug ever did exist it has apparently been fixed. Again, sorry bout that.
It's fine. Always good to be vigiliant in bug reports. XD

 
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Xyos104 ?? Member
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05-07-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Xypherous View Post
A fully charged Q does about 50% more damage.
While you have a point - I think Ashe is a good thing to have in our game.

Graves' smoke screen is actually quite a bit more problematic than Varus' root - simply because it counters his own class so well. Smoke Screen is a superb ranged AD counter - while if Varus' roots an AD carry.. they generally shoot him back.
Well let's not forget that he has the Grievous wounds, which seems that because only 4 champions, a MID tier item and a complete summoner spell can apply it, it seems like it's the most high held de-buffs.
So this mean not only could he root a entire team and poke very well before a team fight he can also screw up any carry who decided to get a blood thirster forcing them to A take the time to walk out of it reducing his DPS by a lot because at level 5 its a 45% slow, or could be easily killed because he has no sustain.

EDIT: Imo I think the grievous should only apply to people who got hit on the initial burst and last for 1 second AFTER they move out of the area

 
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TyranoSatan ?? Senior Member
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05-07-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Xypherous View Post
He has a tank killing ability gated by repeatedly autoattacking the same target and then following up with an ability.

It's very situational and doesn't really scale well with raw attack speed or raw ability power - especially since the followups can be missed or negated.

He can proc his 'tank killing' ability 3 times in a fight, perhaps - as opposed to Kog'maw's continuous barrage of anti-tank - or Vayne's burst combo, for example.

I haven't found this to be true at all from internal playtests - not a lot of characters can trade with MF.
no disrespect boss, but what you all see in internal testing and what IS in the game, are not all that often similar. i direct you to release irelia and xin. fact is, and i reiterate this is not in offense, you guys dont really have a large or thorough enough tester base to really make this call, which is way so often champs are nerfed/buffed within a month of their release. im not commenting one way or the other about his OP or UP ness, however for you to say that x is true because YOU didnt see it in your testing doesnt really mean much. for all you know he could come out and 1v5 teams as soon as a dude figures an optimal item build. or he could come out like fiora and look cool and wind up being VERY lackluster. we wont know till he's live for a week or two.

 
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thei11 ?? Junior Member
05-07-2012

"It's fine. Always good to be vigiliant in bug reports. XD"

I'm still seeing brands q (fireball) go through enemys tho ):

 
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Thryale ?? Senior Member
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05-07-2012

While yer here xyph. would (puts up anti flame barrier) tiamat be a good item on varus?

Speaking of tiamat, who is responsible for the items in LoL? is it this Live group you keep speaking about? I've made a topic discussing Tiamat, but it died really fast....

 
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Felaedor ?? Senior Member
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05-07-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by thei11 View Post
"It's fine. Always good to be vigiliant in bug reports. XD"

I'm still seeing brands q (fireball) go through enemys tho ):
Stealth nerf to those who don't accept the Summoner's Code.

Your abilities only have a 95% chance to function properly.