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@Riot, Does "pushing the bar" mean pushing my wallet too?

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Pira8 ?? Senior Member
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07-01-2012

Respects to this guy.....One of the greatest threads ever created!

 
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Sie Toten ?? Senior Member
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07-01-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by RiotMontag View Post
I can see where you're coming from, but I think you're missing some key spots about what we've done with skins where your logic doesn't quite hold up.

First, let me run with your McDonalds analogy a bit, because it's pretty good. We've actually done something similar by upping the quality bar of skins at an existing price. If you take a look at Soul Reaver Draven, he is really close in quality to older legendary skins: brand new model and animations and really awesome voiceover with new effects that match his aesthetic. We've been able to do this by releasing one skin rather than two, so we can put more time into it while keeping the price the same.

Second, I think your idea that limiting price increase while having unlimited quality ("You cannot up your prices, whilst claiming that you're 'pushing limits', and 'raising the bar'") isn't really realistic. However, there's a balance to that where you do get a high quality product at many different price points where the quality still increases with price. I think we hit that balance pretty well, and I'll use your McDonalds analogy again to explain why.

Let's say that McD decides that, in addition to offering fast food services at a lower price, they're also going to open up a much classier, sit-down restaurant. They'll offer a wide menu and you'll be waited on during your meal. It wouldn't make sense for them to charge the exact same price for that. Of course you're going to go to a restaurant and expect to pay more, because it's clearly better. Pulsefire Ezreal falls into that category. He's a high-class skin. We don't expect everyone to buy him -- I mean, sometimes you just want fast food -- but we do expect people looking for something that's better than most skins to think he's worth the money. This is good for McD's customers because it means that if you want something cheap but healthy, you can get it, but you can also get something better if you're willing to pay for it.

Now, let's pull back and look at all skins at all price points. You have a wide range of quality and price, but generally speaking, as that quality increases, the price increases. We like that dynamic a lot, and we're not going to mess with it. You'll always be able to get something that's cool at a variety of points, including the lower ones, but we're going to reward you with more cool if you're willing to pay more for it. It allows lots of people to get into League at lots of different price points depending on who they are and what they like. We think that's way better than having only one price point (say, $60) and only one level of quality, like most games.

So to your point, I think it's only logical that the price fluctuates at least to a certain extent with quality increase. We're going to spread the love by making new lower priced skins that are way cooler than they were before, like Soul Reaver Draven. You'll never have to worry about being priced out of League of Legends. But that shouldn't preclude us from spending more time on designing better products that are far and above the lower priced skins.


Lower. The. Price. Of. Magnificent. TF. (And all the other legendary skins that no longer constitute as a legendary.)

honestly its not difficult at all, there is no reason to keep them at this price.

We are not asking you to stop making better quality skins. Just accept that those skins are of a lower quality and they should no longer be at that price range.

 
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Montag Montag's Avatar ?? Player Experience Manager
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4 of 8 Riot Posts
07-01-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Alex3omg View Post
The fact of the matter is PFE costs the same as some video games. I'm not talkin' three dollar steam sales- It's what, $20? $30? Something like that. It's way waaay overpriced. $30 is what I'd expect to pay for an expansion pack to League of Legends, not a "theme." That's a DLC price. Skins really are overpriced, that's a fact.
Price is relative to the person. Not everyone will find the same value for everything. Some people won't buy PFE because it's overpriced for them. Some people will see it as just the right price and purchase it. Both situations are fine, and we expect that. That's why he's at the price point he's at.

We also will have skins at lower price points so others interested in getting high quality skins can still do so. They won't be as cool as a future PFE, but they will still be worth it for people willing to pay that lower price.

 
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pavi132 ?? Senior Member
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07-01-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by RiotMontag View Post
We also will have skins at lower price points so others interested in getting high quality skins can still do so. They won't be as cool as a future PFE, but they will still be worth it for people willing to pay that lower price.
What price are you talking about here? Many people have pointed out that it seems 520 has been phased out of existence for future releases.

 
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InsanePlatypus ?? Member
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07-01-2012

And I think what a lot of people forget is that you have a choice in buying skins. Riot also has been updating character models for original skins, and I assume that they will continue to do so. Riot isn't making you pay for anything.

 
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Shentok ?? Senior Member
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07-01-2012

I bought PFE because I missed my chance on getting Striker Ezreal and bought All-Star Akali instead.

 
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zKaede ?? Member
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07-01-2012

Still a valid point: why do those other free to play MOBAs have better skins for the same cap price of $10? Ones that include voice overs, animations, particles, the whole schpeal? Yes, price is relative, so what are Riot's skins bringing to the table that the others aren't, for less?

 
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General Farsight ?? Senior Member
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07-01-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by RiotMontag View Post
Price is relative to the person. Not everyone will find the same value for everything. Some people won't buy PFE because it's overpriced for them. Some people will see it as just the right price and purchase it. Both situations are fine, and we expect that. That's why he's at the price point he's at.

We also will have skins at lower price points so others interested in getting high quality skins can still do so. They won't be as cool as a future PFE, but they will still be worth it for people willing to pay that lower price.
RiotMontag, while I have a lot of respect for you, you're clearly dodging the issues being brought up here. As someone mentioned in this thread, the last time a 520 rp skin was released was Hired Gun Graves, nearly a year ago. Also, you can't justify Magnificent Twisted Fate or Annie in Wonderland being considered legendary. They simply aren't worth the price compared to other legendary skins (and, now that the quality bar has been raised, they aren't worth it even when compared to some of the 975 skins). I understand the words "Magnificent Twisted Fate" work against Rioters in a similar way to how garlic works with vampires, but these are concerns of the community that have remained unaddressed for far too long.

 
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NinetyNineTails ?? Senior Member
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07-01-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by DarkRaiiin View Post
Except for the fact that your economy is stabilized by how much gold you have. Yeah that doesn't concern the average working person.
Oooh, a gold bug! Party like it's 1927, dude! Ron Paul for President!

 
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NinetyNineTails ?? Senior Member
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07-01-2012

The quality bar on new skins relative to old ones at similar price points is going up all the time. Soul Reaver Draven is fantastic compared to other release skins. Most new champions get release skins that are dramatically better than the old semi-palette swapped skins we used to be used to. We've gotten model upgrades for Ashe and will be getting more soon for Sivir, Soraka, and who knows who else, for free. There's a lot of art and graphic content that Riot is putting out for very reasonable prices.

And then there's PFE; an awesome, detailed skin with a ton of new features and cool little touches. For all this awesome, you pay a premium. Riot is very wisely providing quality content at a variety of price points.