I'm unable to tell what you're suggesting. It sounds you're trying to say if it was balanced around tanks picking it up, fighters would have a field day with it. But it also sounds like you're trying to say that if it is balanced the opposite way, that it wouldn't be usable by tanks.
I never heard anyone cry about Force of Nature on Jarvan. Singed? Sure. Lee Sin and Riven? Not once. The only "fighter" I consistently picked it up on was Irelia, but that's mainly because she's a disaster all together. I would pick it up on others if they had an AP top and mid along with a high damaging AP jungler. Chances are though, aside from those special fighter cases, only tanks facing high magic damage teams ever picked it up. And even then, others opted for Aegis and such.

Isn't that why there are diminishing returns on movement speed? Movement speed is fantastic an all, probably one of the strongest stats in the game, but if you're foregoing other statistics solely to get more of one, aren't you hindering yourself? A tank with 600 movement speed is still peelable. If the tank is too fast, then their team can't keep up. If the tank is being peeled and keeps coming back, chances are they're not actually helping their team and/or dying quickly due to multiple bad initiates. No matter how fast you are, a bad initiate is still a bad initiate and can still cost a game. Positioning in a team fight is much more crucial to the likes of an AD carry than a tank. If this were a case of a carry getting infinite speed, it would be a problem. Tanks having infinite speed? They're still able to be kited and they're still able to be peeled via team effort, just like they are now.

I see. I would have to agree with you that the item seems very appealing on those characters now that I know how it works with DoT. Those who have built in slows and do DoT. But I have to say that I don't believe it to be entire optimal on Amumu and Singed. It still sounds like a specific case item though. Maybe I'll see it differently as the season plays out some more. I've only tried it myself on a few characters, but I've seen it done on a lot of them.

That might be why I feel like it's a weaker item. I need to be a character that a Haunting Guise sounds like a good rush on to get the full effect, and I need to be someone who has a slow or I would build Rylai's on so that I don't feel like I'm not fully using the item. The potential is there, but not always accessible.

That doesn't change much of anything though. For all non-Shens, it still means your team is down a guy and the enemy team either has to try to make a move then or they have to come stop you. For all Shens, if the team tries to stop you, you were still successful. If the team doesn't try to stop you, you're about to join your team for the fight.

That sounds exactly like how I thought it worked. That encouraged me to be part of the team when I had it. To make sure everybody gets their effect, I would always be nearby helping em out. Similar to having Aegis, there's no point in having it if I'm not next to my team. Even just like a big size increase in the aura of it would help fix that problem. Bumping it up to like 1500 would ensure that everyone got the benefit if you're nearby. A 10% global CDR aura sounds very godlike in my opinion. If it gave other reasonable stats, I see no reason why something like that wouldn't be core on a lot of supports.

Just losing sleep and tracking on what additional support S3 needs - as usual. Negative controversies are the best ones because it usually means there's something fundamental that's missed and wrong.

No one really gets served by claiming their isn't a problem where there is one, for example - the question is the transition between what the actual problem is from how people feel. The two main takeaways that I want to try is figuring out how to get high-end regeneration back in some form and that we need to do shifts on some of the lesser MR items to be less AP centric and more resistance centric to set them on a better footing.

1) Counter to ADC is tank
2) ADC scales really well
3) Tank must scale well to be able to counter ADC at all stages of the game, OR shut down ADC early so they are useless late (not very fun for ADC).
4) Tanks can't earn gold well
5) for them to scale as well as an ADC, they have to have passive stats/great kit, or effective items.

Armor pen. was designed as counterplay to tanks stacking a defense, now there is no counterplay to armor pen. stacking because it's everywhere and easy to get, plus its still effective against enemies without armor, or only some. It shuts tanks out of scaling as effectively as ADC's because it's so powerful, when the original design was to keep tanks from getting out of hand. Armor pen. probably needs to be looked at for nerfs to make tanks more viable.

Just to suggest something. You mentioned how an HP Chalice is a bad idea, right? For all those same reasons stated, Maw of M. is the exact same, with except with AD. Change the "Gain AD if you are almost dead" part of it. Especially since fights dont last nearly as long as S2. Maybe its just me, but the item seems it suffers the same problems as the HP Chalice idea. - Sorry 'bout the off-topic. Just popped in my head. The quote I'm refering to was:

"A health chalice is something we've experimented on - but in general, it kind of just lied to you about how well you could kill someone and actually kind of pissed people off, more often or not - because the better you poked someone, the worse you felt about the poke since you saw their health chunk up." Replace "health" with "AD" and you'll see what I mean.

Xyph, can you respond to my post on the previous page? It sort of is how I feel about tanks in the current league, perhaps you can give your input on my wall o' text.

Atams 5% MS PLS. That would be so epic.

Very true, but If I get a giants belt, it's probably because I want/need the upgrade fast. When you need health, you usually need a lot of it, and 180-200 won't be enough. the 400 from giants belt is great, and sometimes i'll hold onto that while I build something else, but usually its better to upgrade that for the bonus health (warmogs gives another 600 plus passive) while on non-tank champions the health doesn't seem as important or feel like it needs to be rushed. So maybe there should be an intermediate item for health items like warmogs, either giants belt + ruby crystal, or ruby crystal and rejuvination bead?

I haven't tried buying both giants belt and ruby crystal/kindlegem and holding onto them (unless i'm rushing warmog), because having two tier one items in the inventory without plans to upgrade soon means no space for items like wards or pots while I build the other item I may need. Yes there are a lot of health options, but when building HP it feels like its better to rush the full item (which usually has a desirable passive) than have a couple lower HP value items taking up slots. So maybe there should be an intermediate item for health items like warmogs, either giants belt + ruby crystal, or ruby crystal and rejuvination bead?

On a side note, tanks have 3 highly important stats they have to focus on (HP, armor, and MR), while ADC and AP usually have two (AD or AS as focus, with Armor Pen. or AP/Magic pen.), which might contribute to why they have such a problem. It's alleviated slightly by items that give two stats (sunfire gives hp and armor, bulwark gives a little of everything), but for the most part the best ones are high cost single stat items (warmog/randuin/FH[CDR/mana is useful, but not a priority, the passive/armor is]). A tank isn't likely to get the gold for 3 high stat items (HP, armor, MR), so they have to lose one.

Answer in bold.

I think that was the reason why it was removed in the first place. I don't know why Xypherous tried to cover it up, because it is much easier to agree that it is OP than that it is useless.

I feel so lost without FoN :'(