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What's the point of Ability Power again?

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PoDragonSlayer ?? Senior Member
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04-13-2011

It'd be nice to have Morello or another Red to come in here and comment.

 
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Havy whopons gai ?? Senior Member
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04-13-2011

Quote:
Originally Posted by Doctor Swole View Post
ap champs bring utility. their purpose never was to dominate lategame
The whole reason for adding AP in the first place was to make mages not fall off into only being a walking stun lategame, like in DotA (nevermind the fact that gold loss on death allowed someone like Lina to keep the other team down due to her absolute domination early game, also survivability was not as easily purchased as in this game so people couldn't wade through eight waves of burst like they'd do now if spells didn't scale)

 
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john ?? Senior Member
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04-13-2011

bump in hopes of a red response. kind of sad to see new mages come with 4 damage spells, new dps heroes with 3 abilities scaling off of ad, and old champs getting left in the dust.

 
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Kadzin ?? Senior Member
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04-13-2011

Quote:
Originally Posted by bootbabe View Post
Oh my god riot hire kadzin and make this item!!!



Sounds soooo cool. Soo many new build options open up. Zomg im nerdgasming over the thought of an item like this. LoL's items are pathetic compared to HoN's items. LoL needs to step it up.

Ghostdiem... fail. ABILITY POWER makes sense to scale with ABILITIES. ATTACK damage makes sense to scale with ATTACKS. Who cares if you dont care, it seems alot of other people do.
They should have just named it Spell power sto stop confusing everyone.
In my opinion a lot of abilities should have AD ratios instead of AP, like Yi's Alpha Strike, since it's more of a modified attack then a spell. I don't think we will ever come up with the middle ground on this though, everyone wants different things, and Riot will just have to compromise somewhere.

Also thanks for the Item feedback
Image it on Teemo or AP TF or Kennen or even Jax. Hotness :P

 
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doran1337 ?? Member
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04-13-2011

Most mages are still top tier, their skills have higher base damage and more utility than most AD scaling spells, not to mention the fact that 200 AP costs about 3k while 200AD will cost 2x that.

AD scaling is completely fine as a stat, as long as Riot stops giving the AD scaling champions good base stats, good AD scaling/steroids, high utility, etc. like Renekton, Irelia, Xin, etc.

 
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Rackloy ?? Senior Member
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04-13-2011

I don't understand why you complain. Most of the "casters" didnt have scaling spells in DotA, because they generally scaled with item actives and had better abilities overall. Meanwhile, there were heroes whose abilities scaled with their Agility or Strength.

But then again, comparing LoL to DotA is silly. We have lower cooldowns, smaller manacosts, ability effects are less extreme, mana and healthpools are much, much more larger. And this is the problem of what you argue.

In LoL, the primary source of damage is in most cases your abilities. With all the AP scaling champions, only a handful of AD champs are able to dish out more damage by auto-attacks than the scaling mages put out. There aren't many carries that'd be nigh unkillable and dishing out huge deeps once they've farmed their core items.

The reason DotA works with having auto-attack carries win games, is because they don't have a stat called AP that allows their mages' abilities to scale. As of now, the only DotA style hardcarries we have are, quite frankly, Yi and Tryndamere. Still both of them are rather lackluster in this environment of scaling casters. We dont have an item active that allows them to be immune to most of the abilities (and thus, to hard CC) for 10-5 seconds.

 
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Morello Morello's Avatar ?? Lead Content Designer
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1 of 1 Riot Posts
04-13-2011

There's some validity to this SlyGoat, for sure.

We got lead down this path when we essentially wanted abilities that scaled on non-casters. While I think it can dilute the AP "idea" a bit, I think it's pretty possible to keep this in check, especially when AD is more expensive a stat (a meaningful tradeoff).

I don't think at this point we'd look to move completely away from this as it's been alright at making characters who "feel" physical but don't really auto-attack, plus, it'd be really disruptive for little gain right now.

Good post.

 
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trollolo1 ?? Senior Member
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04-13-2011

AD scaling is getting way too common IMO, it used to be really rare, on just champs like olaf. now champs are getting it everywhere

 
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Larias Larias's Avatar ?? Adjudicator
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04-14-2011

Oh hai Morello!

I lol'd at the time stamps - a red respond, and it stops being responded to.

I still stand by what I said - if Slygoat hadn't developed himself as a troll, he could be an actual good designer.

 
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Kadzin ?? Senior Member
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04-14-2011

Quote:
Originally Posted by Larias View Post
Oh hai Morello!

I lol'd at the time stamps - a red respond, and it stops being responded to.

I still stand by what I said - if Slygoat hadn't developed himself as a troll, he could be an actual good designer.
He evolved way beyond a normal troll.
He is now a Trundle.