The point was the order of emphasis. I thought that was clear... you skipped it again.


Wait didn't you just say something about running to a red. Oh, you run and I crawl. Besides isn't it Riots game? I have followed Sejuani and tanks long before this thread.

OK




I think we all have played a lot of champs. I play lots of champs too (more on that in a sec.) For me its not the fact whether I won or lost, its you that threw out statistics... wasn't it? Its not the fact that you lost the game. First its the fact you didn't even follow your own words. The you felt the need to curse so I fought your curse with your own action. Now about other champions if you look at Ryanarmour3 well that's my sons account see the three odd games in that history? Amumu, Malphite and Rammus... yea that's me.

What? You also assume to much. Back to a previous quote though. I don't know about balance that's for Riot to decide... didn't I even mention something about that in my points of improvement?


As I have said many times, you are allowed your own opinion. Nothing wrong with that.

Uh I'm not talking about meta or balance. I am talking about improvements to a single champ most don't understand or play... probably only ever seen once or twice. So you continue to cloud the issue and avoid my points of improvement.





Again skip everything you want, cloud the topic and avoid an ability comprehend.


Do it so we can see your statistics that don't lie. If you win you are half right as of that point in time... if your wrong?



Balance is not the issue, any suggestion we propose will be balanced by Riot. If they decide to use the idea.


OK not a threat add me I'll be your Sejuani.


Yea again I used your own words to tell you you don't listen to your own statistics that's not childish its sad that you would do that.

Yea its about Sej buffs not meta or balance. That is Riots job.

Btw herp derp you like my other tank games?

Read and +1. I burst out laughing with the "coward button". Pretty clever.

This is exactly what I've been trying to tell Raviance who feels Sejuani doesn't need any drastic changes in her kit.

Sejuani needs help and a lot of it. No one gives a s*** if a tank has an escape tool. Actually, what kind of damn sense does that make anyway? A tank escaping?

"Oh my team is dead. I'm gonna go in 0/3/6 with 0CS and gp5 build and protect our turret. Go Go Dash button!"

I don't even know when you're speaking or when taking a quote from me.

Fix your sh*t before posting. I know you want to rip me a new one but please.. Let me be able to read whatever it is you're cooking up there..

Preview is your friend.

Only +1? I should have at least 12 up votes by now. I hit the nail on the head with that one. They'd have to make up a new category for her called initiator/runner or simply Coward (all in yellow).

But really, we can argue about what needs fixed, and there are probably a dozen ways to fix her and not remake her, but the fact still remains she needs some buffs. She's by far my favorite play style, I just hate that I have to play so safe and run behind the crowd for so long.

ARRRGGGGHHHHH, just fix her Riot.

Sejuani's damage output comes from her W, but it takes an absolutely ridiculous amount of HP to deal decent damage with it (We're talking 4000+) And still it won't go much higher than 250 magic damage per second. With that much HP, you can be sure as hell you won't have any magic pen. Building it is stupid anyway. So your damage is probably reduced by either 1/3 or 1/2. Thats 500 damage over 5 seconds.

On a carry, not too bad, but he'll kill you before you deal half his hp in damage.

I'm REALLY afraid of her becoming the next malphite (Considered underpowered for months, buffed slightly, bugs fixed, SUDDENLY OVERPOWEREDOMGNERFPERMABANSTATUSCAN'TPLAYANYMORE)
We need to start small. Very very little buffs first, then if needed, buff some more. The biggest buff I'd get behind is my suggestion on first page.

Okay, correct me if I'm wrong, but I'm going to try and do the math, her Winds does "Sejuani summons an arctic storm around her for 5 seconds, dealing 12/20/28/36/44 (+0.1) (+0.01/0.0125/0.015/0.0175/0.02 [1/1.25/1.5/1.75/2% of maximum Health]) magic damage each second to nearby enemies." according to League of Legends Profile.

So if she has 100 AP and 5000 HP, not sure you can get both in a 30-40 minute game, but let's pretend. That's 44 base + 10 (.1 * 100) + 100 (.02 * 5000) per second or 154/sec. Let's say you have Sunfire too, so now you're 194 per second. In 5 seconds, with no MR on enemy or pen on your side, that's only 970 total damage. Even Teemo or EZ will have 2000 HP at this point (because I gave you all eternity to get 5000 HP and 100 AP, so they should have 2000 HP).

Let's pretend you lead off with Ult and hit the carry, that's 350 + 80, so you start off with 430 damage. You pop E and get 260 + 50 or 310. And you waste your Q because you aren't a coward (tank after all shouldn't have to run unless team is complete ****) so add another 210 + 40 or 250. So in all, you get 430 + 310 + 250 + 970 (because you are so OP you actually get all 5 seconds of winds on your target. That's 1960, so with your 3-4 swings of that infinitely slow papier mache auto attack you will be able to top 2000 hp in a 5.5 second burst of annihilation.

So, you're level 18 at this point otherwise you'd never achieve these stats or ability levels, which means they are also level 18, and let's say they are so cocky they don't add MR, they should still have around 30 base MR. So let's take that 1960 down to around 1508 actual damage. That means you only did about 3/4 of the HP bar and you now get to start winds all over if they or their team hasn't nuked you, plus you get to swing your paper weapon at them.

But realistically, they'll have closer to 100 MR, and when I play adc or ap carry, or mid, or jungle, or any other position I'll have over 2500 hp by the time you get these super fantastic stats. So that means you'll do closer to 980 actual damage, and that's assuming they don't heal, pot, get shielded, that you remain on them the whole time, you achieve god status abilities and they don't, they don't have flash or a jump ability, and your team is equal to better skill than your opponents. Oh, and your coward button is gone so you're in it to win it or die trying.

And you can say your team has skill so they'll be focusing, and they will be spread out a bit so they can't be CC'd by equal CC attempts, etc., but you also have to admit that their team has an equal chance of being skilled, so your ult hit their tank instead of adc, they are spread out, their support is in back healing and buffing so your ult didn't hit her/him, and your 970 damage is mostly wasted on their melee/tanks, who don't mind it that much since they want to get up close and personal because they want to rip your face off. You're basically relying that you are more skilled than the 'squishies' on the other team and that you're able to get off that perfect ult combo, because otherwise you're really just an initiator that disrupts their initiation, which is probably not 1 dimensional. So, yea, if you're not ganking (upper hand 2v1, 3v2 + element of surprise) then what advantage is your initiation over the enemy? You can't follow it up with anything other than weak damage and a slow, so I guess it's more of a save button to stop their initiation and hopefully pick of the slightly slow player on their team that overextended. And my previous post listed a large portion of the champs that can do that as well as Sej.

Nope, Sej = Fail.

She is a tank, just because she plays different doesn't make her any less a tank.

A lot of people like her initiate and would agree she can do it well.

Yea any champ can soak damage if built in such a way. I don't think its the actual number you can soak, but how effective you can soak. Like I said no champion can force you to target them for the entire duration of a team fight. So the amount you soak should be in proportion to the damage the enemy team is dealing. I have switched to AP in matches to aid in damage because I was soaking enough.

She can peel, 330-10%=297 even Ashe can pull away from that. In a team fight slow still means something. Positioning is not just running at each other joust style. Everyone shouldn't be in range to everyone if you are positioning correctly. That 70% slow allows you freedom to position and focus better.

AoE burn off of AP? Northern Winds scales better off of HP than AP.

She is a tank. She isn't as straight forward as others but she is a tank.

You are seperating initiator and tank where Riot combines the two? Lets look at Cass, are you going to stop building AP on her because she can initiate? Are you going to build Cass tank? You can but you are taking more away from the champ than you are adding.

A crowd button? I disagree as above. I think most player use positioning rather than civil war skirmish lines.

Removing the stop on Q does in fact help her peal better. If she can Q to that enemy regardless of what's in her way it helps her do it better. If she can get to that enemy and apply Permafrost easier she can peal better.

Removing the stop on Q does help her be a larger threat because she can W a squishy and apply Frost. W is much more effective on lower MR than trying to W a tank. Less Health and less Resistance is a greater result.

So the Q stop removal does help her do the job better, everything except sustain.

I'm not the only one... let me crawl to a Rioter again OK?

Other players also believe she just needs minor tweaks.

lol way to avoid. If you could figure out what is yours and what is mine in that small section its just more fuel to the fire that you must be trolling and not even following your own words.

Beija I don't want to rip you anything. You are allowed you own opinion. I didn't curse, you did. I just disagree with what you want to do with Sejuani??? Which is what btw?

I was splitting the two because I don't believe she fits the role of tank. And no one doubts her initiating ability, so your quote from Guinsoo is where I took off with the two definitions.

The reasons why I don't believe she is a tank are as follows.

While yes, her damage scales with HP, poorly, she doesn't have tankiness unique to her. What I mean, is that if Ashe can slow (which you have as a peel) then she can peel better than Sej having ranged quicker auto attacks and W wide range slows.

Ashe can also build strait HP, so she can soak as well as Sej, but she'd never be able to keep up with Amumu for example, making him unique as a tank, Sej is not in this area.

Um, I don't believe the threat comment was refuted, because in order to be a good soak you have to have a reason to be targeted.

Oh, and the reason you'd want AP for damage, while winds doesn't get any real damage from it, your Q, E, and R all scaled from AP. Poorly, but they don't get help from HP. You even post that you get AP to help deal a little more damage.

So to wrap it up, she was designed to be a tank, she just doesn't fit the role, according to Riot's definition.