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@ Riot Please Keep Surge

 
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XFearHonorX ?? Senior Member
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11-21-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by R1ceMuncher View Post
Just wanted to say, I never saw the value in Surge, but I have a friend who smashes the game with it. So yeah, you should keep it. Some players actually CAN use it properly.
Thank you, just hope riot listens...

 
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XFearHonorX ?? Senior Member
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11-21-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bernkarthstar View Post
Your build is full of **** items that is ultimately inferior to a standard DPS build + ignite. Variety is good when they are comparable, but in this case, hybrid AS simply does not compare to crit. Preventing people like you from making an inferior build is precisely the reason that Riot decided to remove Bloodrazor and Surge. It doesn't matter that you can do well with that build; you are being a disservice to your team because you can do better with a standard DPS build.

Again, variety is only good when the options are comparable in quality/strength.

tl;dr: AS build is noob trap, which is why Riot is removing Bloodrazor and Surge
Thats cool that you got a different opinion but really though ill show u in a a game u cant beat me top lane with those items and surge.... Im more then happy to play you right now if you want? I always enjoy educating people that dont understand the how much better that build with surge is, esp. on kayle. I had another kayle do the normal infinity edge plus ignite stuff and i completely destroyed him and of course he was surprised. Lets meet up.

 
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Ovalusc1 ?? Senior Member
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11-21-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bernkarthstar View Post
Your build is full of **** items that is ultimately inferior to a standard DPS build + ignite. Variety is good when they are comparable, but in this case, hybrid AS simply does not compare to crit. Preventing people like you from making an inferior build is precisely the reason that Riot decided to remove Bloodrazor and Surge. It doesn't matter that you can do well with that build; you are being a disservice to your team because you can do better with a standard DPS build. Just because you like to play a certain way doesn't mean that why is healthy for the game.

Again, variety is only good when the options are comparable in quality/strength. Imagine that the only food a community can have right now is apple, but they want more options. Unfortunately, the only other options are tasty poop and bricks. The government decides to rightfully remove tasty poop and bricks as options to prevent stupid people from doing very stupid things and degrade the community.

tl;dr: I'm an ******* and thinks the definition of 'fun' is winning
fixed that for you, some people play things because they enjoy them, and if you do anything enough you'll be good at it. Just because it might not be the best option doesn't mean it's not a good option. So like your apple example, except instead of bricks it's peanuts, and the government removes the option because it's unhealthy for some people to eat them.

 
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Redenbacher ?? Senior Member
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11-21-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by XFearHonorX View Post
Also on a side note, Runaan's Hurricane sucks horribly esp in 1v1 situations. The new rageblade is an upgrade for the tanky jax only not kayle, new passive kicks in at 50% health where as jax would benefit more obviously because hes a lot more tanky and can survive longer to really utilize the passive below 50% hp.

Surge was a hybrid dps spell that worked great on kayles E which was her main source of dmg, Kayles needs attack speed plus she gets more damage with her E with surge, so in all reality more AS and dmg trumps what ignite would ever do with its tiny 70 true dmg at lvl 1. I play Kayle 90% of the time and surge is insanely good on her if used at the right time, if riot removes it its because surge takes timing and skill which most other spells dont require that kind of effort. All i can say is kayle is deadly with surge if used correctly and im literally going to quit when season 3 hits with all the bad item and spell changes. I love this game and never had an issue with balance changes until now.
Well, my head was going to the place where Kayle is below 50% HP, gets the buff from Rageblade, pops up her shield, and heals back to full with lifesteal while decimating the opponent. This, in turn, sets her up for a multi-kill.

It seems you favor an on-hit build, which given current itemization is hard-countered by magic resistance and/or AS Redux because it doesn't benefit from the multiplicative scaling of AD/AS/Crit. The nice thing about AD Carry Kayle is that she benefits from mixed damage, which is more difficult to defend against. The last time I faced an on-hit Kayle, I was playing Malphite. One Randuin's Omen later, Kayle no longer contributed to teamfights.

Now you're mentioning you prefer Surge because of it's level 1 power, which I agree is probably unmatched on any other champion because of her E... however, that power curve quickly changes as the game goes on and AS items can be purchased. At that point, one well timed Exhaust will shut you down (unless you're packing the new Mercurial Scimitar! ...or cleanse.)

Most importantly, I'm still not seeing a compelling argument for Surge beyond Kayle. There are over 100 champions in the game. Quite frankly, the argument that it shouldn't be removed because it's good on less than 1% of those champions is weak. Especially when it's primarily strongest at level 1. Once you can purchase the new SotD, you have no reason to have Surge any more.

 
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Henry Plainview ?? Senior Member
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11-21-2012

surge is bad and you should feel bad

 
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XFearHonorX ?? Senior Member
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11-21-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Redenbacher View Post
Well, my head was going to the place where Kayle is below 50% HP, gets the buff from Rageblade, pops up her shield, and heals back to full with lifesteal while decimating the opponent. This, in turn, sets her up for a multi-kill.

It seems you favor an on-hit build, which given current itemization is hard-countered by magic resistance and/or AS Redux because it doesn't benefit from the multiplicative scaling of AD/AS/Crit. The nice thing about AD Carry Kayle is that she benefits from mixed damage, which is more difficult to defend against. The last time I faced an on-hit Kayle, I was playing Malphite. One Randuin's Omen later, Kayle no longer contributed to teamfights.

Now you're mentioning you prefer Surge because of it's level 1 power, which I agree is probably unmatched on any other champion because of her E... however, that power curve quickly changes as the game goes on and AS items can be purchased. At that point, one well timed Exhaust will shut you down (unless you're packing the new Mercurial Scimitar! ...or cleanse.)

Most importantly, I'm still not seeing a compelling argument for Surge beyond Kayle. There are over 100 champions in the game. Quite frankly, the argument that it shouldn't be removed because it's good on less than 1% of those champions is weak. Especially when it's primarily strongest at level 1. Once you can purchase the new SotD, you have no reason to have Surge any more.
I wasnt just talking about lvl 1 surge, i was talking about lvl1 through 18. But the thing about malphite for one is that hes a tank with an attack speed debuff that lasts a long time and has a short cd so hes a dps carry cripple... And ive seen many tanks build lots of magic resist and life like they always do friend and i can tell you i melt them all the same... Malphite on the other hand is very hard to beat late game no matter what type of carry you are mainly because of his attack speed debuff that he will spam on you. Ive played this game a long time with Kayle and i have friends that do the AD crit to win Kayle and they have never beat my build in top lane during team games or during a custom 1v1. Late game its the same thing i always beat them i do far more damage and this is coming from gold and up league players so i think they know how to play. I know a good hybrid kayle is by far stronger then an AD crit to win kayle.

If you honestly think that my Kayle is so weak play me with your malphite ill show you the way i use kayle should be respected.

 
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Arketual ?? Junior Member
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11-23-2012

You only seem to be talking about Kayle...
Not going to leave a summoner just so those Kayle players (She's not even popular in any region...) can get a kick from extra AP and attack speed for a couple of seconds. Just prepare for the new Season 3 itemization to kick in and expand your build rather than being thickheaded for a lousy summoner.

 
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Retribution753 ?? Junior Member
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11-24-2012

Keep Surge, noobs. Why remove it? I use it all the time with several of my champs. It has a unique effect on gameplay not to mention certain strategies.

 
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Raherin ?? Senior Member
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11-24-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by XFearHonorX View Post
Thats cool that you got a different opinion but really though ill show u in a a game u cant beat me top lane with those items and surge.... Im more then happy to play you right now if you want? I always enjoy educating people that dont understand the how much better that build with surge is, esp. on kayle. I had another kayle do the normal infinity edge plus ignite stuff and i completely destroyed him and of course he was surprised. Lets meet up.
You will barely ever see Surge taken in high Elo competitive play unless they are just goofing around. And you will never see it used by anyone in any serious tournament - ever. Riot admitted Surge can be utilized by a select few champions, but at the end of the day it mostly is a spell that sets the player and the team back. Aka: noob trap. Riot doesn't just remove summoner spells nonchalantly, they have thought about this.

 
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MauxFire ?? Senior Member
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11-24-2012

I'm inclined to listen to the diamon player