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How to Make Darius More Fun for Everyone

 
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MemoryLapse ?? Senior Member
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01-31-2013

Darius capitalizes on positioning errors? No. Darius has a huge range around him that other champions cannot encroach upon lest they receive an unfavorable exchange. You are correct that he has a low skill cap to be played effectively, but regardless of skill cap the hero's kit is extremely one sided compared to any similar champion (AD based melee bruiser).

Darius gets free range to farm at lvl 1 if he is fighting any other AD bruiser. Meanwhile his opponent must stay outside of his range waiting for him to spin so they can dash in and get a few last hits and get back out side of his range.

You normally are required to actually do some work in a lane to create that situation. Darius gets free lane dominance at lvl 1. This is, in my OPINION, imbalanced.

Can Darius be countered? Yes of course!

I am not implying there are no ways to beat Darius in a lane. The problem is that you are forced to use a different type of champion to do so. You need to use either a ranged champion, or an AP based melee champion. I think you should be able to have counters to a champ WITHIN that champ's archetype. That way one can put another AD bruiser against him and expect a reasonable fair exchange.

Currently this is not the case.

 
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Keitterman ?? Senior Member
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01-31-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by MemoryLapse View Post
Darius capitalizes on positioning errors? No. Darius has a huge range around him that other champions cannot encroach upon lest they receive an unfavorable exchange. You are correct that he has a low skill cap to be played effectively, but regardless of skill cap the hero's kit is extremely one sided compared to any similar champion (AD based melee bruiser).

Darius gets free range to farm at lvl 1 if he is fighting any other AD bruiser. Meanwhile his opponent must stay outside of his range waiting for him to spin so they can dash in and get a few last hits and get back out side of his range.

You normally are required to actually do some work in a lane to create that situation. Darius gets free lane dominance at lvl 1. This is, in my OPINION, imbalanced.

Can Darius be countered? Yes of course!

I am not implying there are no ways to beat Darius in a lane. The problem is that you are forced to use a different type of champion to do so. You need to use either a ranged champion, or an AP based melee champion. I think you should be able to have counters to a champ WITHIN that champ's archetype. That way one can put another AD bruiser against him and expect a reasonable fair exchange.

Currently this is not the case.
What darius are you playing against that gets free lane dominance? Just as shyvana you can bait him in to swinging with ease. Remember that his spin has to hit you at max range for it to hurt, so run at him and turn a few times. Repaet until he swings. When he misses, and he will, you go in and drop your superior kit on him, and get out before spin is back.

What's that? Darius got frustrated and decided to E you in to him (and lets suppose it didn't miss) now it's on, and you get to pound on him until you feel like using your escape to leave (for shy it's burnout) because he has no ability to chase you. his speed boost from the bleeds will wear off faster than your escapse, so just choose wisely when to leave, and you're fine.

How do you eat an elephant? one bite at a time. If you know you can't survive going head long in to a fight against the guy, switch to a bite-by-bite tactic.

 
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KImre ?? Senior Member
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01-31-2013

I don't feel like to explain the thought process behind my ideas so here they are:

Increase the stacks.Adjust the dmg accordingly.
Q,W and E feels okay in my opinion though it's kinda weird to level up E to gain %armor penetration.
Using his W ability it not noticeable in any way until it is at lvl4,5.It is mainly used for applying a stack and slow to stick to the target but not for the dmg.
Since Darius kit does not allow him to quickly get away from ganks or disengage in little scenarios thus his ulti need to deal true dmg sadly.IF somehow he gets in his kit something that allows him to close the gap or can be used as an effective escape method than his ulti needs to deal physical dmg and %armor pen should be placed to R and then some utility/dmg/applying stack whatever he needs should be added on E.
With the increased number of stacks %additional dmg/stack need to be reduced on the ultimate from 20% to a reasonable level.
However with the increased stack number to deal full dmg with the ulti you would need to apply more stacks which means more time for counterplay.
The base damage and ratio maybe should remain unchanged.
However on assist it will now refresh.
ONLY on kill with the ultimate half of the mana cost is refunded.
Note this is only on kill which means now you might be able to execute everyone without causing problem using your other abilities because of mana costs however because of the increased stack number it will be harder to reach the maximum potential of the ulti thus it will be harder to kill people with the execution ability even though one of his ability is an AoE.

All in all:
Increased stack number for more time of counterplay.From 5 up to even 10?Only testing can determine the good number here.
Decreased %additional dmg/stack on the ultimate.
Ulti now refreshes on assisst too.
On kill only it will refund half of the mana cost,on the second kill it will refund half of the previously refunded mana cost and so on.

 
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MemoryLapse ?? Senior Member
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01-31-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by Keitterman View Post
What darius are you playing against that gets free lane dominance? Just as shyvana you can bait him in to swinging with ease. Remember that his spin has to hit you at max range for it to hurt, so run at him and turn a few times. Repaet until he swings. When he misses, and he will, you go in and drop your superior kit on him, and get out before spin is back.

What's that? Darius got frustrated and decided to E you in to him (and lets suppose it didn't miss) now it's on, and you get to pound on him until you feel like using your escape to leave (for shy it's burnout) because he has no ability to chase you. his speed boost from the bleeds will wear off faster than your escapse, so just choose wisely when to leave, and you're fine.

How do you eat an elephant? one bite at a time. If you know you can't survive going head long in to a fight against the guy, switch to a bite-by-bite tactic.
What game are you playing?

Scenario:
An average Darius misses a spin, Shyv engages on him, likely drawing minion aggro. Darius autoattacks, passive engages, doubles strike with cripple which slows her, 2stacks of passive ticking; 3rd swing of autoattack hits. Minions hitting her. She tries to get away, gets pulled back, passive maxed. She MIGHT get away but this is not a favorable exchange.

God help you if he actually lands the spin first...

Byt he way you are competely ignoring the fact that shyv cannot do jack **** to him UNTIL he misses a spin. WHat if he just sits in the middle of the creeps and last hits saving his spin for shyv to get in range???

 
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Soraffeson ?? Senior Member
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01-31-2013

Darius isn't OP at all...Just as any champion, if he is fed, then he becomes a pain in the ass. I've seen a fed Nami and a fed Sona which do **** tons of damage but yet they are support. Darius is the same way, he has his champions that he just kills pretty much automatically like teemo, annie, veigar, etc but yet there are champions that counter him like Rammus and Renekton. If you play darius and you stack health you are hard to kill but yet in a team fight 5v1 or 5v2 or even a 5v3, once they kill the other guys..you're screwed. When playing against Darius just stack armor and health and be sure to CC him since he can't be like Ezreal and just double flash across the damn map. Darius has 1 main objective, hit you 5 times and then ulti....if you blind him with a teemo, stun him with veigar, tibber stun him with annie and then have your adc come in...darius is dead no matter what. I don't see a darius nerf needede while there are other champs more often played that need nerfs.

 
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VaschLagHammer ?? Senior Member
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01-31-2013

Ou

Quote:
Originally Posted by MemoryLapse View Post
Darius capitalizes on positioning errors? No. Darius has a huge range around him that other champions cannot encroach upon lest they receive an unfavorable exchange. You are correct that he has a low skill cap to be played effectively, but regardless of skill cap the hero's kit is extremely one sided compared to any similar champion (AD based melee bruiser).

Darius gets free range to farm at lvl 1 if he is fighting any other AD bruiser. Meanwhile his opponent must stay outside of his range waiting for him to spin so they can dash in and get a few last hits and get back out side of his range.

You normally are required to actually do some work in a lane to create that situation. Darius gets free lane dominance at lvl 1. This is, in my OPINION, imbalanced.

Can Darius be countered? Yes of course!

I am not implying there are no ways to beat Darius in a lane. The problem is that you are forced to use a different type of champion to do so. You need to use either a ranged champion, or an AP based melee champion. I think you should be able to have counters to a champ WITHIN that champ's archetype. That way one can put another AD bruiser against him and expect a reasonable fair exchange.

Currently this is not the case.
You just answered your own argument honestly. Darius range is small. Which is why he is countered hard by ranged champions. But you already answered this. Are you telling me you're going to play your desired champion, despite the fact that Darius will kick your ass? Or will you play a ranged champion and make him cry. Seriously play any champion that has range ability. Olaf is situational. But he can shut him down with poke from his Q and E. There's nothing imbalanced about this

 
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JustMyBassCannon ?? Senior Member
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01-31-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by MemoryLapse View Post
What game are you playing?

Scenario:
An average Darius misses a spin, Shyv engages on him, likely drawing minion aggro. Darius autoattacks, passive engages, doubles strike with cripple which slows her, 2stacks of passive ticking; 3rd swing of autoattack hits. Minions hitting her. She tries to get away, gets pulled back, passive maxed. She MIGHT get away but this is not a favorable exchange.

God help you if he actually lands the spin first...

Byt he way you are competely ignoring the fact that shyv cannot do jack **** to him UNTIL he misses a spin. WHat if he just sits in the middle of the creeps and last hits saving his spin for shyv to get in range???
Fantastic, you completely ignored anything Shyvana's capable of, like DPS that exceeds Darius'.

And you're suggesting the Shyvana player's a dumbass as well, saying they'd engage when the minion wave is stacked against them.

 
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CerealBoxOfDoom ?? Senior Member
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01-31-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by JustMyBassCannon View Post
Fantastic, you completely ignored anything Shyvana's capable of, like DPS that exceeds Darius'.

And you're suggesting the Shyvana player's a dumbass as well, saying they'd engage when the minion wave is stacked against them.
why do minions matter, she'll have full fury by the time she even bothers engaging

 
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Oz SammyD X ?? Senior Member
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01-31-2013

Oh shutup this Darius **** is getting old, he is not OP, he is a well designed champion, there not going to change something just because low Elo or blind pick noobs can't beat him, good players have 0 problems with him so clearly if you can't beat a Darius then you are not a very good player, l2p.....

 
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Armageddal ?? Senior Member
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01-31-2013

Here are a few ideas for ultimate tweaks that have popped into my head:

1. Cause Darius' ultimate to deal no damage to a champion if that champion will not be killed by the blow (in effect, making an ultimate "miss" more of a true miss). This would make Darius players more careful about using their ultimate.

2. Give the ultimate a timed, damage ramp-up. The damage is currently based on a stack system, so you could increase the rate the damage increases per stack, but then cause his ultimate to deal considerably less damage if he has cast it very recently. This will drastically reduce his ability to spam it for multi-kills.

e.g., Each stack of of Hemorrhage on the target causes Noxian Guillotine to deal increasing damage (1 stack = +35%, 2 stacks = +60%, 3 stacks = +80%, 4 stacks = +92%, 5 stacks = +100%; the damage increase is front-loaded, requiring less stacks to reach high quantities of damage, but still requiring 5 to reach the maximum of +100%). Damage is reduced by 20% for each subsequent cast within 5 seconds.

3. Give Noxian Guillotine an increasing (+50-100?) mana cost for each subsequent cast within 5 seconds.