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I'm convinced Riot doesn't care for what they've done to supports

First Riot Post
 
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Kldran ?? Senior Member
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08-08-2011

Quote:
Originally Posted by ladygagaissexy View Post
Can you elaborate a little more Shurelia?
I think the more elaborate version is:

 
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Kite911 ?? Senior Member
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08-08-2011

Quote:
Originally Posted by Phreak View Post
It wasn't so much "deals AoE damage" as "oneshots you if he gets lucky with E or headdesks if it bounces away to minions." This is why Q and W are his consistent damage tools, while E is built to splash -MR on enemy targets, not really caring if you double- or triple-hit.

In Brand's case specifically, the R missile is slow and allows you to run out of range before it bounces. Surely you've noticed players scattering to minimize bounces.
to be honest i am still pissed about Ryze's remake destroying his style and forcing him into a boring 1 build 2 ability spamming drone

but this thread is about supports, why bring up brand and ryze

 
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Zarthorn ?? Senior Member
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08-08-2011

TBH the Kayle thing wasn't actually Shurelias fault (not white knighting here just stating fact) she was moved off onto another project before the Kayle rework was finished, thus the person that messed up Kayle was not Shurelia.

I've been watching the info Shurelia has been giving us with keen interest, as a support player myself I do want us to be so much more than just the "babysitter" although at the same time, I do enjoy being able to help my carry be the best they can be without detriment to there farm.

I do worry that we have been getting conflicting information from other reds about Morellos plans for support, moreso for Soraka since its been made clear he utterly hates the champion, the conflicting info is that Supports are being shifted to a more Lux and Morgana model and this is a bad thing and defeats the purpose of being a true support champion.

If anything, Alistar and Janna are the ideal supports to be molded from, Alistar performs admirably well as a tank AND as a support thanks to his utli and great CC, Janna brings a lot to team and can be itemized to become quite deadly but not doing so does nothing to her utility.

Supports should be optionally itemized, there utility should be strong whatever the choice as that is what they do best, however should you choose to itemize the benefits should be worthwhile and not feeling that you are greedily taking farm away for it to be useless.

Just my thoughts on it.

 
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dogbiter ?? Senior Member
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08-08-2011

just add another lane

 
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Shurelia Shurelia's Avatar ?? Associate Game Designer
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08-08-2011

Quote:
Originally Posted by dogbiter View Post
just add another lane
Lol that would work... haha.

 
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Alpengeist ?? Senior Member
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08-08-2011

I really don't like the 0 cs waiting in the back doing nothing minus pressing a few buttons.

The skill gap between a good support and an OK support is not very big, which I don't like.

It's boring to play, and you don't feel very good when you play well, because you think to yourself "gee, anyone coulda done that."

 
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standin ?? Senior Member
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08-08-2011

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zarthorn View Post
TBH the Kayle thing wasn't actually Shurelias fault (not white knighting here just stating fact) she was moved off onto another project before the Kayle rework was finished, thus the person that messed up Kayle was not Shurelia.

I've been watching the info Shurelia has been giving us with keen interest, as a support player myself I do want us to be so much more than just the "babysitter" although at the same time, I do enjoy being able to help my carry be the best they can be without detriment to there farm.

I do worry that we have been getting conflicting information from other reds about Morellos plans for support, moreso for Soraka since its been made clear he utterly hates the champion, the conflicting info is that Supports are being shifted to a more Lux and Morgana model and this is a bad thing and defeats the purpose of being a true support champion.

If anything, Alistar and Janna are the ideal supports to be molded from, Alistar performs admirably well as a tank AND as a support thanks to his utli and great CC, Janna brings a lot to team and can be itemized to become quite deadly but not doing so does nothing to her utility.

Supports should be optionally itemized, there utility should be strong whatever the choice as that is what they do best, however should you choose to itemize the benefits should be worthwhile and not feeling that you are greedily taking farm away for it to be useless.

Just my thoughts on it.
I never put fault on Shurelia for Kayle. I know it was someone else.
Haven't read everything else in your post, sorry, going to read her response right now.

 
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KonFewShuN ?? Senior Member
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08-08-2011

Quote:
Originally Posted by dogbiter View Post
just add another lane
as short and blunt as this looks, this actually seems like a very good idea.

 
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IS15d25bf1bdf6f0 ?? Senior Member
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08-08-2011

Quote:
Originally Posted by Shurelia View Post
The problem "supports not wanting to farm" is a deeper problem that stems from the nature of what support is.

Since resource is limited, it will be optimal to place the resource onto champions that you want to support. In almost all cases with the exception of end game (full items) it is optimal to stack resource onto a single target... its sort of the same reason why you try to feed kill gold to a specific person when possible.

The other solution (which I've heard brought up again and again) is to increase the scaling on supports to cause them to want to farm, but does this really solve anything?

Problem 1: Support Ratios become OP and the person who doesn't want to farm shifts to another character in the lane. Ex: Suddenly tanks/tanky dps don't want farm and they go bottom lane instead to babysit the support who wants to farm.

Problem 2: Adding damage ratios that are strong enough to want support to farm causes supports to be only better at what you don't pick them for.

The only solution that has been tossed around that I think would work is split resource sharing in duo lanes, but its a really big change that really will flip a game mechanic upside down.


Of course if anyone has any good ideas, I'm all ears.

Have you considered, in regards to problem 2, adding AP Ratios to things other than damage and healing? Less tangible things like the stat boosts that are tacked onto a lot of these moves?

In regards to problem 1, eventually you reach a point where having someone not farm at all is simply a suboptimal decision.

 
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Ozt ?? Senior Member
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08-08-2011

Quote:
Originally Posted by Shurelia View Post
*sigh*
Boo hoo. Truth hurts.