Originally Posted by Morello
This is part of the reasoning. I'll be posting some of the design reasons behind this in the next few days in more detail so there's a clear understanding of what the impetus is. People will agree and disagree respectively, but I think it's important to understand our rationale here and remove some of the guesswork.
One of the bigger reasons is the hard-counter nature of it and how stacking it to any reasonable level is a big problem (which disallows us to really utilize the mechanic or putting many ways in the game to get it).
Dear Morello/ Riot,
Firstly, thanks Morello for an official message regarding this thread. I know from another red post from another thread (Pendragon) that Riot are not yet ready to fully reveal their plans for dodge, where it's going and how things are going to be (or indeed your decisions about dodge if you have decided any).
The main objection against the initial red post on this thread was that he was talking about the visual effects as an argument against dodge, rather than any conceptual rationale behind it.
If you read this thread, and I know it is a huge thread, there have been many, many good arguments as well as counterarguments about dodge, and especially the argument regarding dodge vs crit. While many here seem to be just writing their thoughts or analysis impetuously without having read those arguments (not know their exact same points were already pointed out earlier in this thread), I thought I should mention a few things about dodge as a mechanic.
I notice that "hard-counter nature" of dodge is one of the main problems with dodge, but in this thread it has been argued that the wholly negated damage from dodge are usually compensated by critical chance. Many posters on this thread have pointed out:
"Yes, dodge does negate one whole attack's worth of damage, BUT DOESN'T CRIT ALSO ADD THAT ONE WHOLE ATTACK'S WORTH DAMAGE TOO?"
Besides this logic, it is the mechanics of this game which allows critical chance to be built to near 100%, making it no longer an RNG element of the game. The chance of a champion crit hitting is almost always higher in every game than a champion dodging an attack, and as we all know, the crit DAMAGE boost can sometimes go up to 250% - 304% using obvious items such as infinity edge, crit damage runes etc.
Dodge, on the other hand is capped, and is mostly below 25% on champions other than Jax (I do also note that many champions use dodge runes other than Jax, Udyr and Nidalee. Many players have told us in this thread that they use dodge and dodge masteries (now gone) on tanks, AD melee champions and junglers).
The point here is that the frequency at which crit can occur is almost always going to be higher than dodge, and the extra damage that comes with one crit chance can be more than 200% of the normal attack damage, which more than compensates one dodged attack.
Many have also argued the counters to dodge and crit chance. The main vein of the argument for counter to crit chance has been armor (not surprisingly) and many have also argued that dodge can only be countered by one item.
Before I delve into any further issues, I just want to point out that dodge is a defensive element of the game, while critical chance is an offensive element. The former does NO DAMAGE, while the latter inflicts DAMAGE. This is where the word "counter" comes into. Some have argued that it is somewhat useless to think of countering something that does no damage to you. Indeed, if one had to choose to counter ONE of the two--crit or dodge--one would always be inclined to counter crit chance, because crit chance can kill you, whereas dodge cannot.
Another salient argument here is that more counter to crit is needed because crit chance can be built to usually over 70-80%, while dodge is capped way below that percentage. It is only logical to have more counters to crit because crit is more likely to occur in one game compared to another.
Many interpreted dodge as one of the counters to crit, because it is a well known fact among many players that crit cannot be countered by armor alone (I also note that dodge can also counter true damage, which cannot be countered by armor). Indeed, we have seen on many occasions in which a tank with 3000HP with a frozen heart and a thornmail was shred to pieces by 250% critting AD carries. Dodge only adds an extra counter to that. And even with dodge, it is usually crit chance/ damage that comes out on top of armor+hp+dodge.
However, many find the current state of the game (with dodge) balanced, at least in the context of countering crit or true damage. One prime example of this is how Jax counters Tryndamere, the champion that probably best embodies the crit chance/ damage into his kit.
Jax is a champion introduced specifically to keep those massively critting AD melee champions under control, because without Jax, they would rule the World. Then who counters Jax? Well, for starters, AP burst champions laugh at Jax because their casts cannot be dodged. And AP casters aside, we have seen fed AD carries still owning Jax after phantom dancer and infinity edge (I am being really general here). My point here is that removing dodge will break this balance, as we can see from recent threads already complaining about Tryndamere being the new FOTM with the removal of dodge in the new masteries and boosted crit chance/ damage percentages.
In short, I concede that dodge is a hard counter to crit, although it is needed to prevent a landslide fights in which crit chances/ damages can wreck the game.
My final point on this issue is very personal. As much as I understand the general theme of more aggresive play and aim to reduce the game time by nerfing escape mechanisms, I would also say that many value the delicacy and variety of elements that this game offers. This game is very distinc from games such as DOTA for the obvious reason, because it introduced more features that can counter each other out to bring more fun in building and learning skills to execute in teamfights. Builing rune pages, masteries, increasing crit damage as well as dodging all form part of this opinion. My point here is that (as I have experienced) a huge proportion of players in this community like this game because it is different from the old-school "who-does-more-damage" games. This game has introduced champions like Teemo, Shaco and recently Fizz, who encourage us to play with more thinking and planning and sometimes, reflex. This game was different because it does not necessary encourage all-out fight, damage and kill, but because it offers another spectrum in the game: evasion, traps, escape and also, dodge.
Indeed, many feel a huge satisfaction when they dodge a killing blow, just as when a person deals a crit hit to finish the enemy. If crit, as an RNG is here to stay, then it only makes sense dodge stays. Dodge is a hard counter that wholly negates an attack, but unlike crit, it cannot be built to near 100%. That is the compromise for the dodge mechanic - lesser chance of it occuring than crit, but a great reward when it occurs.
Finally, having written so much about our thoughts of dodge-lovers, I would like your formal answers on the following sometime soon:
1) Are you going to remove dodge completely?
2) If so, what have you decided so far about champions with in-built dodge mechanics?
3) What was the logic behind removing dodge and nimbleness from the mastery tree?
4) and a question MANY would love to hear: If you plan remove dodge completely, WILL Riot refund those IP to those with dodge seals and quints?
I really appreciate your response in advance.