@morello

I love playing supports. My favorite is Janna, but when the AD carry that im supporting isnt my friend they tend to get harassed a lot more than Janna's shield can do. I've found her lack of sustain to have slightly pushed her out of the meta especially when there is a support like Sona or Alistar that have decent sustain with mass CC.

I thought about it a little and tell me what you think of this: Give Janna's shield an increased HP regen for whoever she throws it on. That way it isn't a straight up heal(which would make Janna extremely OP) but it still gives her sustain so she and her AD carry cant get harrassed out of lane as easily. Also another possibility to keep the HP regen sustain from outlasting the poke from the enemy is to attach it to the shield so if the shield gets harrassed down so does the HP regen buff

i c wut u did thar.

Question, Morello. You've mentioned that you guys will "ramping up" a couple of things on Soraka, presumably in recompense for the hit(s) she'll be taking from the fix(es) to her infinite sustain. Do these positive changes constitute small buffs to the numbers on her healing (i.e. this matter is purely number-tweaking on HP gain over time from Astral Blessing and MP gain over time from Infuse), or do they affect or are they otherwise aimed at other aspects of her kit (e.g. damage, silence)?

WARNING: REST IS TL;DR

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I don't see how you would change Infuse other than dialing down the mana restoration to Soraka. Since the issue is infinite sustain, the restoration to allies is beside the point. The cooldown is difficult to adjust without touching the silence, as well.

Increased CD on Infuse means that Soraka has a harder time protecting her laning teammate from that AD/tank kill lane (or, God forbid, a double-stun lane). Increasing the silence wouldn't be good - it's already 1.5s at LV1, 2.5s at LV5. Any longer during early game, and it becomes a ridiculous zoning tool; any longer during late game, and you'll be shutting down a caster for the majority of the duration of skirmishes and teamfights (2.5s is already crucial for casters like Brand, shuts down DPS and escapes for assassins like Talon, and with some teamwork can lead to instagibbing characters like Annie).

Decreased CD alone on Infuse should be out of the question (closer to permasilence you get, the less healthy the ability). Decreased CD and silence on Infuse, however, would lead to a mini-silence, which would be of no use to a support character during laning phase. Interrupting a channeled ability, which is all it'd be good for at that point, is more useful later in teamfights, whereas the only use in laning phase would be for notable exceptions such as Jungle Fiddle's Crowstorm which you usually wouldn't see coming to begin with.

Upping the damage component on Infuse wouldn't be good, either - while it'd make for a better poking tool, it's already easy enough to inadvertently killsteal when you're trying to shut down an escape. Taking the kill gold when you should have taken the assist gold only puts your carries and damage dealers behind.

Since I can't see how you'd "ramp up" anything on Infuse, and I agree with you on how Wish is in a healthy, clutch spot right now (ignoring the cheese factor of popping it for assists across the map; I don't want to hear that alternative means of gaining gold is bad when we're stuck in a 0cs-gp10-support meta), the only feasible positive change I can see, outside of Astral Blessing heading towards either a burst or more-frequent-small-heals extreme, would be to increase her damage output. That would mean either a rework of her autoattack or a buff to Starcall. You seem to be hinting at this, but I'd rather read it in English than in Phreakese.

Has her autoattack been reworked? Has Starcall been buffed? Or, again, is this just tweaking-the-numbers-on-sustain?

So i perused all the red posts in here aka Morello's and Phreak +1'ing tons of dmg. And i get the impression that Morello thinks no one can die as long as Soraka is around, just because she has infinite mana. I understand that Sona's power no longer comes from her sustain, it's more that she is a kill lane doubled with a healer. She does great, dare i say tons of, damage early on and has a strong hard cc that can lock down both the desired target AD and the support to prevent a heal.

I was about 1200 elo last season, I'm about 1400 elo this season, while I have gotten better across the board, my climb was largely a result of my playing and aggressive Soraka. I maxed R>E>W>Q w/o taking a point in q until 13 and I STILL ran the risk of going oom because i wanted to push E to harass, since I knew my advantage was the limited healing capabilities on the enemy team. Having unlimited mana isn't making Soraka OP (was she ever even picked in last major tourney?) its what makes her unique. If she loses this, I will be devastated, she is my favorite support, and pushing E to get mana for me is a last resort, but i still think this will ruin her.

What are you talking about? I'm not saying that heal is bad because it gives you something you didn't have before. Not only is your argument a fallacy, it's not even about something that I'm arguing.
I'm aware of how summoner spells work and their impact on the game. I don't find there to be a problem with flash. I was making the comparison with flash because of the arguments that were made about flash when it was being nerfed. Flash has a very similar function to flash when used defensively in that they both happen instantly. Flash differs from heal in that it changes your positioning, not your health bar. Both can be used very similarly offensively as well in that you do something aggressive knowing you can get out.

They also have some different uses. Heal can be used to heal up after an engagement while flash can be used to close a gap while chasing. You can't heal-stun and you can't flash-sustain.

My problems are that the extra use of heal creates passivity more often than not and that it is more often that heal is used defensively in the "oh ****" moment. While it does happen with other summoners, I find it to occur with heal much more often.

Not from my experience.

Maybe he is just poor and Irish? I didn't get my first hat until like Trading was enabled and I had been racking up tons of hours since beta @@

You seem to have missed the part where sustain is something they're trying to get rid of. Also Janna is probably the best designed support and one of the best designed champions in the game. She's what supports should be like.

Also, to the guys above comparing flash and heal, flash is much, much, much worse for the game than heal is, but Riot will never do what is needed (remove flash) because it would be "Too disruptive."

so what exactly are you arguing? i read your argument was that heal wasn't always used for heal baiting, but you say that's not your argument? i must have gotten lost some-ware, i Sorry.

If your argument wasn't that heal wasn't being used as a baiting tool, aka, aggressive play, what exactly was your argument?

because my summoner spell doesn't say anywhere it should be offensive or defensive, i see it used in both ways, i use it in both ways,

It's not "the supports." It's certain "supports". Some are defensive (Soraka), some are a mix (Taric, Janna), and some are all offense (Leona). I think it's okay to have a healthy mix of styles. The problem is, certain supports are just "best." Soraka/Sona, mostly.

We have the same with AD carries: Caitlyn and Urgot are big bullies, Kog'Maw just wants to farm. However, if any one AD carry is way too good (i.e. Graves since release), we nerf so that other AD carries can be relevant.

speaking of graves are you guys going to finally tone down his laning phase a bit? He essentially never runs out of mana in laning phase and I think thats his biggest tipping point in balance.