Originally Posted by HG MasterSpartn
I surrender the game when you lose two team fights in a row and the score is 24 and 54.
However I bet you can see a win here for the team with 24.
The OP states his point rather brashly- but I think hes actually right.
League is not about kills- its about killing the enemy nexus. There are 5 champions standing in your way. I have seen brutally disparate matches come back because some teams understand that and some dont. Your post speaks to that. 54-24 is easily winnable in many cases. Not in every case mind you- but if you just look at the kill score you're not even considering the right surrender criteria. Pros come back from disparate KDA discrpancies all the time (although there margins are smaller because they allow substantially less deaths to begin with).
I look at your comment and I dont necessarily see a win but I say:
Are we built for late game? Do they peter off? Not always the case but sometimes plays a role in early game losing streaks.
Is anyone intentionally throwing or going John Rambo out there? If your losing "team fights" then my guess is no and that you guys had enough skill/synergy to stick together. That is a HUGE step in the right direction.
What are the turrets at? Based on the score- Im assuming bad- but they are exponentially more important than kills and the fact that they werent even mentioned in your post speaks to a mindset where people have a flawed notion of when surrender conditions are met.
How many dragons do you have? Do you have vision on baron? Mid to late- especially in low level games you can almost always turn a game around if you're able to gain vision and secure objectives because other unskilled teams totally ignore these or at best have sporadic interest. They repeatedly throw themselves at your turrets giving you a substantial edge in most late game fights. If you know enough to stick together you should be able to win those.
So whats the alternative to surrendering?
Turtle up- play straight defense- stop worrying about kills. You will get heavy farm anyways if you are defending at base.
Stick together- obviously defend seperate lanes when necessary but DO NOT initiate any team fight ever unless you see 4 other allies on your screen.
Focus map objectives- Once you do win a teamfight or even get a kill or two- use the momentum to get vision on the map. get dragon- keep baron warded- grab buffs. Too many times people get a shred of momentum and they wanna storm the enemy gates. Acknowledge that even if you win a teamfight you are STILL behind- you are still defending.
Press tab- Players are way too content to say "so and so is just OP". No so and so is not OP. In fact the most OP champs that are usually banned, get banned because of a strategic niche they fill or a dangerous kit combination not because of an inherent scaling flaw where a champ or ability just becomes unstoppable. Kat/Darius/Yi/Whoever has snowballed at this point is not OP and have pretty easily identifiable counterbuilds. If Shen split pushed you to death or Kayle ultd there adc every time you jumped on him- you may have a valid complaint- 90% of the time this is not the case though. Hint: look at MR/Armor and/or armor/Magic pen.
* I just lost a game to a team we had crushed 41-20 at one point and I can give credit where it is due- we didnt even throw. They just played good. They were pushed in their base and still came out ahead- they just fed Vayne and Rye when they could and waited for late game. Good on them to notice we had two black cleavers and no %health damage- so although I was shocked to see that they had two warmogs on two seperate champs (Darius/Mumu)- I had to acknowledge that was an insanely well played counter. In the end they had Darius built as a pure tan who just hooked away anyone who tried to jump on their carries and Mumu used his stun defensively rather than as an initiator.
They turtled up. They researched and counter built. They adapted their strategy in game.
We overextended. We built our champs in a bubble without any synergy. We tried storming their turrets over and over again.
Hope that helps