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Champion Relaunch: Katarina, the Sinister Blade

First Riot Post
 
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AwesomePdudE ?? Junior Member
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08-11-2012

Now she's just a glorified akali.
The bouncing blades leaving a mark for bonus damage is like an improved Akali Q.
The Shunpo is like Akali's R.

 
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DanmakuHeaven ?? Member
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08-11-2012

so she is akali mk3? I mean we got diana allrdy

 
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Demxi ?? Junior Member
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08-11-2012

Overall, while I like the changes I am disappointed for a more personal reason. I have always loved katarina as a character personality and a champion to crush people with. For the longest time I felt like she was my champion, because people would always say kat is so trash or kat is bad. When I was at PAX east I overheard someone in the dominon line talking aloud about how riot had one of their weakest champions (kat) on all of their ads or sort of like a.... spokesperson? Well, I have always done well with kat and I expect to continue doing so, but now I feel like more people will play her and more people will view her as viable. I will miss the days of dominating as kat because I knew when to ult to get all or most of it off before some smart player stopped me, shredding the enemy team, getting a triple or quadra kill, and feeling good because everyone always talked about how "useless" katarina was.As I said, I feel the changes are a good idea but I feel like it is more of a punishment to good katarina players and a helping hand to those who weren't so great at her or did not know when to get a propper ult off. I'd like to know what some rioters think.

 
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Bobstein ?? Junior Member
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08-11-2012

Kat was already OP why make her more Op riot?

 
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Ur little sister ?? Senior Member
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08-11-2012

Some feedback after trying her out:

1) Her early/mid game got nerfed.
- Bb pushes the lane when she tries to lasthit. (Unless the ennemy champion doesn't zone you at all and allows you to melee lasthit). Hence: jungle pressure
- BB is now almost impossible to hit against a skilled opponent. Because they know exactly how the bounces will go. Also mind that the only moment Kat players used to have where harass was almost guaranteed was when the minions enter the lane. Because they all run in a fixed (short) distance from each other now, harassing at this moment has become impossible (unless your opponent hugs his minions). The champions that used to counter kat (and really, there were a lot) just do so harder.
- BB harass went down even if you do manage to hit it. Partially cause of the base dmg nerf, partially because at max rank you hit less targets and partially because you can't activate the full damage on all hits portion anymore. The healing reduction being lost is also an issue, as it used to be really powerful when the ennemy used a health pot. The last thing (loss of healing reduction) is something I don't think is really fixable/revertable for the new Kat, but I feel it does make a big difference.
- I feel Kat's matchups are now less skill based, and more predetermined. This is because BB's almost impossible to hit via bounces, but it got a range buff, and hitting it directly is realistic against some champions. Again, I feel champs that used to counter her just do so harder now, and champs that didn't do so less now.
- Her total burst is lower than it used to be, assuming she gets a full ult off. Key in this are the total ult damage nerf, and the removal of the passive damage on Killer Instincts. Getting her ult off fully, whilst not realistic in decent teamfights, was almost the definition of good timing in the early / mid game.
- The huge early rank cooldown on Shunpo means you're permanently playing defensive. Get ganked when it's not up? dead! You can't juke them out till the cooldown refreshes anymore, or do several ward hops in big jukes. And if your E gets forced, you're forced to play passive for way too long. This in my mind is mainly is what makes the reworked kat not feel like kat anymore.

2) The dependance on her ultimate went down.
- I think this was the main intention of the rework. It worked and I love it. Your damage without the ult went up, and I feel more useful when not ulting. I also feel that I can save my ultimate for a more crucial moment more. I used to feel obliged to use it when an opponent got caught out of position once, just to assure he didn't escape. Now my regular skills' damage is enough for this purpose, and I can save the ult for the play that my team is going to make after killing the overextender.

3) Her farming potential went up.
- Not early game, since Kat's new early game is more exploitable than her old one. But if her opponents choose not to crush her early (jungler focus + lane freezing + zoning) and she can get some ranks into Q and W... She can clear minion waves SO fast o.O!

4) AD is trash on her, hybrid/gunblade not viable
- Her harass has no AD ratio, only her W and ult do. Now having done the calculations, when it comes to gold-efficiëncy, raw AP is about 2ce as gold-efficiënt as raw AD. (Which is, I'm guessing, why most hybrid abilities in the game have an AD ratio that's 2ce their AP ratio.) Now old Kat had an incentive to buy AD: it was more gold efficiënt on her harass abilities than AP. (AP was better for her burst damage though). New kat's ratios are either AP or 2*AD + 1*AP. This means that there is no aspect of her gameplay anymore of which AD is more gold-efficiënt than AP. The fact that her AD ratios only apply to burst spells and not to harass (you can't harass at melee range in mid lane with a squishy abusable champion with no real escape) and her total burst is WAY better off with AP than with AD doesn't help this.
- As for gunblade: the slow component also got worse due to the reduced ult time. So basically I see no reason to upgrade that hextech revolver into a gunblade anymore. The AD is COMPLETELY wasted (ALL of your spells that would scale with it scale equally hard gold-value wise with AP), and the slow is only 2/3rds as useful as it used to be.

5) Ulting from inside a brush, a fun play that many Kat players have used to turn games around has been nerfed hugely. Not only does your ult deal less damage overall, but ennemies now also get a visual indicator of it being cast on them, being the grievous wound.

Overall, I'd like to stress that I'm really happy/excited with the direction the rework is taking, but the shunpo cooldown ruins a lot of the fun, and the early game nerf on what was already a champion by many claimed to have the worst early game in the game is... troubling.
Also, I think more people will play her and will believe/realize she's viable, because her artwork improved, and against people with 0 sense of positioning she will always stomp her lane.

 
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Iare ?? Junior Member
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08-11-2012

I just don't understand why change Katarina, when there are many of good players out there with her, and she is a decent champion, when RIOT doesn't look to others champions that, in my opinion, are outplayed and forgot.
Trundle is a example. I love to play with him, and besides I'm kind of good with it, he is champions who doesn't have place on the fields of justice anymore, it's like anyone can beat him just because they have better abilities and kits.
There are others too, in my mind, who are being forgotten. Anivia, Viktor, Zilean, Sivir, and a few others who, I think, aren't good choices in any game matchmaked.

 
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Eagleskings ?? Junior Member
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08-11-2012

I feel like the change to her Bouncing Blades is almost too similar to Akali's Mark of the Assassin. The main difference that it can affect 5 targets at one time. Activating Kat's mark should do something like lower CDs of abilities by .25 seconds, or cause a light bleed effect similar to Darius' passive.
The same thing is true for the new spin attack given to Katarina compaired to Akali's spin attack.
Just an opinion, as Riot has done wonderful things to make every champion unique, it seems odd to put similar abilities on two assassin champions.

 
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BlureSpace ?? Junior Member
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08-11-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by AwesomePdudE View Post
Now she's just a glorified akali.
The bouncing blades leaving a mark for bonus damage is like an improved Akali Q.
The Shunpo is like Akali's R.
Katarina will always be a unique champ as riot has always preservered. He has a uniqu passive that's equally if not more important that her ult. and a ally/minion jump shympo that allows unpredictable movement.I think i speak for a lot of players when i say that as long as katarina's skills light up when she get an assist or kill, she'll be one of the funnest champ to play.

 
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Covenants ?? Senior Member
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08-11-2012

Its the weekend so probably wont see a red post in here again. But while I like the "idea" of reworking her slightly, and the new W ability is a good start, and I dont even mind the ult change so much. But Katarina IS shunpo. Thats what made Kat -> Kat. Leave shunpo alone as it works now, dont change it, dont do anything....the cooldown is perfect, the damage is perfect.....pretty please???

 
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Gameoverthee ?? Senior Member
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08-11-2012

Katarina utimate needs a buff, why u increase its channel duration? u should keep it or reduce it. Also his w seems useless now, also the healing reduction efect should go back to his q like before, i like the e buff.

When u commit to a fight , now u dont have many opportunities to use her ult and the damage overall without it is less than any other caster AND U CANT APPLY YOUR HEALING REDDUCTION DEBUFF. That was one of katarina strong points, Well i cant say anymore, ill go back to my room and cry about those changes to his q.